Wretch 32 is, by his own admission, an "all-rounder".
Gaining experience on the rigs, soundsystems, and pirate radio stations that fostered grime, the rapper then began to encroach on the mainstream.
2011 album 'Black And White' – his first for a major label – notched up over a million sales, suddenly pushing Wretch 32 into the upper pantheon of British pop.
Yet he never forgot his roots. An incredible performance on Fire In The Booth – 1Xtra's always essential freestyle segment – proved that he could cut it with the best of them, while sessions for his second album took on a more thoughtful, introspective tone.
Now a father, Wretch 32 can't help but look at the world around him and wonder if it's going in the right direction. New album 'Growing Over Life' is a vehicle for these thoughts, a place to express his doubts and worries, but it's still a party, still a place for joy and rapture.
Clash caught up with Wretch 32 to find out more.
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So, how did you begin to approach 'Growing Over Life'? Do you feel it's a reaction to your commercial breakthrough?
You know what it is? In a weird way I’ve almost mapped out what my albums are, and when they’re to come. So, ‘Growing Over Life’ – for me – was always after ‘Black & White’, but in order to write ‘Growing Over Life’ I have to have experienced a lot more than I did when I wrote ‘Black & White’. The only difference between ‘Black & White’ and ‘Growing Over Life’ in time is success. Before ‘Black & White’ there isn’t any success. That was the new thing in my life, to add to the chapter of my life diaries. It’s going to take a long time for me to document what’s happened over 30 years of my life. So this is definitely the record that documents the most. And I can go back the furthest, and I can also see the rise, the possible fall, and then looking to rise again. It’s a good outlook of where I am today.
How did you begin putting this together? Do you focus on the lyrics first?
I think I focus on the mood. For me, I think about the concept of the album, what it needs to represent, what it needs to feel like. And then once I know the mood, and I know the texture, I know exactly what needs to be said. And then the lyrics just flow, and I can find what producers fit what I’m saying at that time.
How did you recruit collaborators? Was it a case of focussing on one track, or did you have a cast in mind to fit the album’s over-arching themes?
I knew I wanted people that I respect musically. That’s the most important thing. I know that I’m gonna love what they bring to the record, and then hopefully the people are going to love it, too. In terms of producers, it’s who I connect with. Micky and Mone they made the majority of the album and they’re like family now. We’ve got a good rapport and we can create – we constantly create. With the artists, it’s who I’m a fan of at the moment. I try to really get the best of the best.
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You also did Fire In The Booth recently, which was an absolute storm. How do you balance your love of the freestyle, with a more structured studio environment?
I’m just able to do quite a few things. I feel like I’m an all-rounder. I can make records to go in the charts, I can do Fire In The Booth, I can write a song for a female artist. I am able to write, and to create. I think it’s good to show different sides to your coin. The only thing that’s a bit frustrating is some people are like, I hate commercial music – so they’ll only listen to Fire In The Booth. Then some people are like, it’s just words and no chorus – so they only listen to commercial music. I don’t belong to one world, I just want to bring everyone to one room and say, look, you like a bit of that, you like a bit of that, and I can deliver everything. I’m not anti-commercial and I’m not anti-underground, I’m pro-music, and music comes in all shapes and forms for me.
British music feels like it’s in a very special special – look at Stormzy, Skepta crossing over without diluting their sound. Do you feel like the time is simply right for this crossover sound?
I think so. I think you’ve just got to make sure everyone gets it, because the point of being an artist is that you’re the creator and you’re supposed to be ahead of the average person in terms of what you specialise. I specialise in music, so I’m supposed to see the next six months in music before the consumer. And sometimes you could be so far ahead that everyone is playing catch up. And sometimes that’s when it becomes a bit of a problem, because you feel stagnant, as not everybody gets what you’re doing. I don’t see that as a wrong thing. The right thing for you to do is just to do what you’re here to do, and that’s always what I’m willing to go with.
‘Antwi’ discusses the have-nots in British society, the people living below the breadline. Why tackle this right now?
I think I’ve been going through a battle with my children. The battle that I go through is that as a kid I didn’t have a lot. And now I have kids I can give them more than I had. The battle is: do you give them what you never had, because you never had it, knowing that it made me this hungry, and this determined 20 years on? Or do I give them everything and just hope that they still have this hunger that I have. So, that’s the battle I’ve been going through.
A lot of that is coming out in my music, so that’s where my head was at when I was tackling it. Do you give your kids everything? Or do you hold back, so they have a bit of hunger in their life? I remember what I used to have to do to get my games. I’d have to go and clean a car. Or you’d swap two games for that game, or sell a game… just creative things. I’d have to get creative to make a tenner. But now they get money for their birthday, so does it change their walk of life? Are they now less creative than the person who had less? So it’s kind of just me, at demons with myself, really.
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I’m not anti-commercial and I’m not anti-underground, I’m pro-music…
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A huge part of that hunger comes from not having something, and desperately trying to get it.
That’s it. And then sometimes you feel selfish because you’re able to do something, but you’re not doing it. Am I holding them back? It’s a tug of war.
‘Dreams To Sunshine’ tackles race – has this focus also come through having kids? Do you notice aspects of racial identity, and of prejudice, a little more?
I think just being a sponge from what’s happening in society. There’s definitely so much going on right now in this present moment that we’re living in. I’m quite an emotional person, something might effect me and I’m unaware, until I pick up my pen and I start writing, and it just flows out. I think a lot of that has been in my head because of all the killings that’s been happening, all the shit that’s going on. I just think… to a degree I have always spoken about it, but I think now that it’s happening a lot more I think these lines are getting highlighted a lot more than when I was saying it seven years ago on my first CD. So I think it’s just the magnifying glass, it’s been magnified and them lines are standing out but I’ve always spoken about it and it’s something that is personal to me.
Could you imagine becoming more involved in politics, do you think?
The thing is, I like to know a lot about what I’m talking about, and I don’t know too much about politics. So I always only give my skin offering, like whether we should have voted stay or leave: I feel like we should have voted stay. I just feel like it’s been like this for so long then if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. Who are we to turn our nose up at anyone? In terms of the actual politics of the situation I don’t know too much, I probably know as much as the average person. But it’s just me giving my offering on it. I’m not too political, so I just kind of say my piece on that and then step out because I don’t want to feel like I’m talking about something I don’t know much about. I don’t know the in’s and out’s.
Do you feel like the country is going in the right direction? When you look back on your roots, would you have the same chance starting out now?
It’s funny because what I do notice is that the council estate that I grew up in, where there’s poverty, or people have less… we have more ethics. And we behave better to each other. We have behave with each other. There’s less racism in a council estate than there is where I live now. Where I live now is this nice little complex and not everyone holds the door for me. And I don’t know if it’s down to racism, or if it’s down to not being used to seeing someone like me there, or if it’s me being afraid. I don’t know what it’s down to. Or being judgemental. But in my estate, where I grew up, we’d hold the door for whoever. Any woman carrying a bag, we’d help them up the stairs. We had more morals. More morals and less money. It’s probably the more money you get, the less morals… I dunno. I dunno how that one works out.
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There’s less racism in a council estate than there is where I live now.
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Emile Sande on here, you’ve worked with her before – did she pop into the studio with you? How did that one work?
She did it with me – an absolute queen! She’s one of my favourite artists to work with. She’s so special, man. It’s always a pleasure to have her on board. So I don’t know what else to say… she’s just someone who pushes me. Normally I get that feeling when I’m in with another rapper. Where I’m like, I’ve gotta make sure my lyrics are sick because this guy’s gonna chew me up. She has but in soul format – she can really say some slick shit, man! I’m always fascinated by what she’s going to say next, always in awe of her watching her create. I just think she’s one of the best artists of my lifetime.
Shakka’s on here, too…
Shakka’s a bad bwoy!
You mentioned earlier that you had a mood in mind, so how free were each of these artists? Did they have free rein, or were you taking control?
We all worked on it together. I gave Shakka the record and I was like: I want this specific song to just go somewhere else. I want it to be dreams to sunshine, I want it to feel like… he just gets in. He goes in the booth, and then we start talking about what I meant in depth, and then… yeah, it comes out.
Is bringing all these disparate elements together something you can do naturally, or is it a difficult process?
It’s funny because once I know what the concept of the record is I know what I need to say. So whether I say it in one track, or whether I say it over 12 tracks, it could vary. The sick thing about when it’s like that, is that when I know exactly what I need to say there’ll be like four different versions of this, and we’ll take the one that feels better with the other songs. So it’s like writing a film knowing exactly how it’s going to end – the beginning, the middle, and the end. And then all I need to do is, like, sometimes you might not need a scene, so you’ll take the scene out. Or add another scene.
Roll Credits.
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'Growing Over Life' will be released on September 2nd – purchase LINK.